Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

[Blank Page]

I'll bet this has been discussed before but I tried a couple of search terms with no luck. So I'll ask here: Is there any way to overcome the "stairstepping" of diagonal lines when a photo is reduced in size? A lot of my shots that affected by that. It's got to be the biggest drawback of digital photography in my opinion, especially if you're posting pics on the web.

Climbing too many stairs,
BP

[Ian]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

Typing this on a train using my pda

If your software is resampling the image there should be no jaggies, but if it is just removing pixels you will get jaggies. See if your resizer settings are set to resampling.

Ian

[Blank Page]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

I didn't know there were options, but I just looked into Paint Shop Pro (v 8.10) and I see I have five: Pixel Resize (which it is set to), Smart Size, Bicubic, Bilinear, and Weighted Average. (This is in the box that pops up when I click Resize.) There's no Resampling option that I can see.

I'm off to work now so I can't check for replies till later.

Thanks.

[bigbob]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

Don't think you can , a pixel is square so when you zoom right in on a diagonal line you'll see it's made up of hundreds of tiny squares 'stepladdering'
I find that Photoshop accentuates those lines and when it's either printed or viewed in explorer they seem smoother .
B..

[Blank Page]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

I was afraid of that, although I'd still like to hear about "resampling". I just did a bit of research and while I din't find anything about that, I did learn about anti-aliasing which Paint Shop Pro doesn't seem to have. It sounds like anti-aliasing isn't a total cure though as it seems to render the picture less sharp (like the Soften tool in PSP - maybe that's their version of anti-aliasing).

I can't say my pics fare better in a browser than they do in PSP. A few of them on my web page still suffer horribly from "stepladdering".

Thanks for replying, even though it wasn't what I wanted to hear.

[Tinka]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

I was afraid of that, although I'd still like to hear about "resampling". I just did a bit of research and while I din't find anything about that, I did learn about anti-aliasing which Paint Shop Pro doesn't seem to have. It sounds like anti-aliasing isn't a total cure though as it seems to render the picture less sharp (like the Soften tool in PSP - maybe that's their version of anti-aliasing).

I can't say my pics fare better in a browser than they do in PSP. A few of them on my web page still suffer horribly from "stepladdering".

Thanks for replying, even though it wasn't what I wanted to hear.

Hi Blank Page,
I am fairly new to digital anything including photography, but I read a lot and try to absorb info, and everything I have read states that to maintain the quality when resizing you should not "RE sample, and we should make sure the "Re sample box is UNTICKED" .All I can suggest is try it and see.

[Blank Page]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

I'd like to try it, but I can't find a "Resample" box to tick or untick in my PSP. I'll keep looking.

[rogleale]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

Hi Blank Page,
As I mentioned in Ian's "Sharpen or Resize" thread, Qimage is a magic solution to printing problems. Download a demo from here

[Pol]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

I'll bet this has been discussed before but I tried a couple of search terms with no luck. So I'll ask here: Is there any way to overcome the "stairstepping" of diagonal lines when a photo is reduced in size? A lot of my shots that affected by that. It's got to be the biggest drawback of digital photography in my opinion, especially if you're posting pics on the web.

Climbing too many stairs,
BP

As a matter of interest - what type of screen are you using?

I have no problems with 'jaggies' when I view my resized images on my CRT screen (Mitsubishi DP 19") but I was using my laptop yesterday and noticed some of the lines on some my gallery images appeared jagged. My laptop has an LCD 17" UltraSharpT Wide Screen WUXGA (1920 x 1200) so I suppose it was my 'ultrasharp' laptop screen causing the jaggies?

I don't do any processing on the laptop - I prefer using the PC + CRT.

Pol

[Stephen]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

As a matter of interest - what type of screen are you using?

I have no problems with 'jaggies' when I view my resized images on my CRT screen (Mitsubishi DP 19") but I was using my laptop yesterday and noticed some of the lines on some my gallery images appeared jagged. My laptop has an LCD 17" UltraSharpT Wide Screen WUXGA (1920 x 1200) so I suppose it was my 'ultrasharp' laptop screen causing the jaggies?

I don't do any processing on the laptop - I prefer using the PC + CRT.

Pol

As you know Pol I use a 17" laptop all the time now 1400x900 I never seem to suffer from jaggies. However viewing at less than 100% will not help. So in the galleries it may be more noticeable if viewing the smaller version of your image rather than the full size version

[Pol]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

As you know Pol I use a 17" laptop all the time now 1400x900 I never seem to suffer from jaggies. However viewing at less than 100% will not help. So in the galleries it may be more noticeable if viewing the smaller version of your image rather than the full size version

I had been viewing at 100%. My shot of the DLW spiral staircase looked dreadful on the lappy - jagged lines all over the place.

I also looked a few others in the galleries - images from others that I knew had looked good on the CRT. Some of those looked jagged on the laptop too - though your Saltaire Church looks fine on both CRT and laptop.

Does my DLW spiral staircase have noticeable jaggies and/or halos on your laptop? I can detect them very slightly on the CRT but nowhere near as bad as on the lappy - I guess it must be due to the differing screens and resolutions?

Here's the large version.


Pol

[Ian]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

I had been viewing at 100%. My shot of the DLW spiral staircase looked dreadful on the lappy - jagged lines all over the place.

I also looked a few others in the galleries - images from others that I knew had looked good on the CRT. Some of those looked jagged on the laptop too - though your Saltaire Church looks fine on both CRT and laptop.

Does my DLW spiral staircase have noticeable jaggies and/or halos on your laptop? I can detect them very slightly on the CRT but nowhere near as bad as on the lappy - I guess it must be due to the differing screens and resolutions?

Here's the large version.


Pol

LCD screens are much less forgiving than conventional CRTs. You really need to sit back to view a typical LCD without being able to see the screen pixels.

There is also less dynamic range in an LCD which makes stepping in gradations more perceptible.

Super high resolution LCD screens are better - as with Epson PhotoFine displays on their P-series photo storage drives, for example. But these are usually much smaller screens than a PC monitor.

Ian

Ian

[Pol]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

LCD screens are much less forgiving than conventional CRTs. You really need to sit back to view a typical LCD without being able to see the screen pixels.

There is also less dynamic range in an LCD which makes stepping in gradations more perceptible.

Super high resolution LCD screens are better - as with Epson PhotoFine displays on their P-series photo storage drives, for example. But these are usually much smaller screens than a PC monitor.

Ian

Yeah. I'd only bought the laptop back in the Summer when I'd had a major catastrophe with the PC and I desperately needed to be able to get online for reasons other than photography. I have a high spec Dell 'Media' laptop with the best screen available and it's superb for Film/DVD, backup etc - but I really prefer the PC and CRT, especially for photo processing.

Pol

[Ian]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

Yeah. I'd only bought the laptop back in the Summer when I'd had a major catastrophe with the PC and I desperately needed to be able to get online for reasons other than photography. I have a high spec Dell 'Media' laptop with the best screen available and it's superb for Film/DVD, backup etc - but I really prefer the PC and CRT, especially for photo processing.

Pol

You could try reducing the brightness of the brightness of the display, that could help. General purpose LCD displays are often too bright for photo display anyway. Do you calibrate your monitor too?

Ian

[Pol]

Re: Jagged lines when reducing size of a photo

You could try reducing the brightness of the brightness of the display, that could help. General purpose LCD displays are often too bright for photo display anyway. Do you calibrate your monitor too?

Ian

My monitors are calibrated regularly with Spyder2 - CRT weekly (maybe a day or two over) and the laptop monthly.

I have no LCD screen other than the one one the Dell laptop. The colours are fine, matching well with the CRT - also most photos look fine on the laptop screen. It's mainly those photos with prominent lines that seem to look worse on the laptop screen.......... mainly anything at about 800 x 600 or less.

Maybe I shouldn't have done a quick, albeit slight 'smart sharpen' after I'd resized the image for the web. I guess that may also have added to the jaggy/halo effect.

Does the staircase look poor on your screen?

Pol