Leica's long-expected full frame M9, plus interesting new X1 compact analysed

[DPNow]

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DPNow looks at where Leica is going with its new, fully German-engineered, X1 compact digital camera, and the new full-frame M9. Can such expensive and, arguably compromised, cameras be a crucial part of Leica's plan for survival in these credit crunch times?

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[Bob Ross]

Re: Leica's long-expected full frame M9, plus interesting new X1 compact analysed

Hi Ian,
The sensor in the X-1 is the open question. I'd say the candidates are Sony or Samsung (as in Pentax). The next question is did Leica eliminate the AA filter, as they did on the M8/M9. That would certainly set it out from the crowd.
Cute as it is, the X-1 is also spartan in the feature department, compared to the nearest competition, micro 4/3rds.
The M9 is a temptation for me, because all I need is the body and because the price is lower than I expected. The funds I had for the M9 went on the floor last month and now I walk on it every day There seem to be a few subtle improvements to the M8's operation, so I'll be watching the IQ discussions about how well they did with the edges.
I think the significance of the X-1 is like the DP-1/2. It will provide an incentive for others to compete and we get more to choose from
Bob

[Ian]

Re: Leica's long-expected full frame M9, plus interesting new X1 compact analysed

Hi Ian,
The sensor in the X-1 is the open question. I'd say the candidates are Sony or Samsung (as in Pentax). The next question is did Leica eliminate the AA filter, as they did on the M8/M9. That would certainly set it out from the crowd.
Cute as it is, the X-1 is also spartan in the feature department, compared to the nearest competition, micro 4/3rds.
The M9 is a temptation for me, because all I need is the body and because the price is lower than I expected. The funds I had for the M9 went on the floor last month and now I walk on it every day There seem to be a few subtle improvements to the M8's operation, so I'll be watching the IQ discussions about how well they did with the edges.
I think the significance of the X-1 is like the DP-1/2. It will provide an incentive for others to compete and we get more to choose from
Bob

Crucially, the M9 has the IR filter built in. I really don't know how Leica fouled up on that one with the original M8.

It's interesting that Leica points out that the M9 is the smallest full frame digital camera, even though it's actually quite large compared most compact and medium sized digicams.

Ian

[Bob Ross]

Re: Leica's long-expected full frame M9, plus interesting new X1 compact analysed

Crucially, the M9 has the IR filter built in. I really don't know how Leica fouled up on that one with the original M8.

It's interesting that Leica points out that the M9 is the smallest full frame digital camera, even though it's actually quite large compared most compact and medium sized digicams.

Ian

Hi Ian,
I wont appologize for Leica's engineering call, but there are quite a few digital cameras with known IR problems. These are better known to the Pros who have to have accurate color all the time. The Nikon D100 (?) needed a IR cut filter made by Tiffen and the Epson R-D1 clearly showed it on synthetic cloth. I think it is an engineering call and where the engineers are told to show the lenses in the best light for resolving power, they don't consider color. The original AWB on the M8 was atrocious, too. A few firmware fixes later it is fine.
Yes, the Leica M series was never considered a compact, but it is smaller than DSLRs. One fun measurement for comparisons is to calculate the camera frontal area to sensor area ratio. The M8 was good and the M9 even better. Try that with one of those Pany FZ50s where the sensor is button size for an extreme. In the end it is the feel of the rig and there I have a built in bias, having used Leica Ms for decades & Contax IIs before that.
They are bricks, the finder is amazing and the lenses are outstanding. They are not as versitile as an SLR, but the direct view window VF invites a different kind of seeing. Rangefinders are not easy to explain to those who haven't used them. I am glad they are still around.
Bob

[Ian]

[Bob Ross]

Re: Leica's long-expected full frame M9, plus interesting new X1 compact analysed

Hi Ian,
There is no AA filter in the M8 and when I got mine, I ran around looking for repeating patterns to get some moire to learn how to fix it. I didn't have any success in producing moire with JPEG or DNGs. It can be done with some fabric patterns and probably window screens, but it doesn't show up normally. My E-3 on the other hand has no problem producing moire, when I try
There may be something to the space needed for the IR cover and that may have something to do with the newer shutter, besides the sound reduction. The IR cover filter coupled with the off-set micro lenses and the angles of light, might have produced some nasty color shifts. Ultra wide lenses with IR filters will produce cyan tinted corners needing PP when not corrected in camera. The widest that I have is 28mm and there doesn't seem to be any color shift in the corners when the in-camera fix is turned off.
I think that using the 4/3rds system has spoiled me for corner to corner sharpness. The M8 has it with the lenses that I have, but I'll be watching the M9 images closely in their corners.
Bob

[Atlasman]

Re: Leica's long-expected full frame M9, plus interesting new X1 compact analysed

Crucially, the M9 has the IR filter built in. I really don't know how Leica fouled up on that one with the original M8.

It's interesting that Leica points out that the M9 is the smallest full frame digital camera, even though it's actually quite large compared most compact and medium sized digicams.

Ian

IMHO, to hold claim to the smallest full frame is something to tout about.