IR Real or Simulated

[Patrick]

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

The second one has more of an authentic IR feel for me, but I'm very inexperienced about such things. The camera we have had converted is due to be delivered today, but there has been a big traffic accident locally and traffic is at a standstill. It could be we'll have to wait another day...

Ian

[Graham_of_Rainham]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

Rarely do we get to see real and simulated IR side by side for comparison and the "fake" ones are sometimes quite difficult to spot.

I'm going for the second one as being the one done with an IR Filter.

Hopefully we will see more of these comparisons.

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

The converted camera arrived after all and I have just literally been outside the office snapping what I can in the late afternoon light:


This is a colour image (RAW) processed in Lightroom 3.4RC with just some contrast, sharpening, and white balance adjustments.


And the same image again, converted in Lightroom to mono.

Olympus Pen E-PL1, 720nm IR conversion, ISO 200, f/8, 1/250th.

Going to have lots of fun with this!

Ian

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

The unprocessed images look rather like colour negative film frames

Ian

[Graham_of_Rainham]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

With a DSLR conversion, you would still be composing with the OFV and would not have the advantage of being able to see the IR image in live view.

I would imagin this with the 9-18 will produce some excellent IR Landscapes.

Thanks for showing them so soon.

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

So Patrick - are you going to reveal which was the real IR and which was the simulated one?

Ian

[Patrick]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

So Patrick - are you going to reveal which was the real IR and which was the simulated one?

Ian

It was the second, but I knew most would know which, there is a delicacy about real IR that is difficult to achieve through manipulation, although I have thought about playing further with fake to see if I can improve on my efforts thus fare.

See you are excited about your converted camera, the colour negative like file is because the colour balance was set agains green, which is what I used. Set the colour balance agains white and you will get red colour file. The end result would be the same when converted to B/W.

Patrick

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

Thanks Patrick. A popular technique in processing IR is to swap the red and blue channels - here is my first go at this:



Ian

[devilgas]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

the tell tale is usually in how non organic objects appear. in patricks 2 photos, the urn gives it away. in IR they tend to look flat and not show the great variations in luminance. something that is quite difficult to fake.

being the new owner of patrick's IR 10d, i may do a few side by sides this weekend. looks like i'm going to have to wait a while before doing IR astro shots though as the objects i wanted to try it with aren't visible at the moment.

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

the tell tale is usually in how non organic objects appear. in patricks 2 photos, the urn gives it away. in IR they tend to look flat and not show the great variations in luminance. something that is quite difficult to fake.

being the new owner of patrick's IR 10d, i may do a few side by sides this weekend. looks like i'm going to have to wait a while before doing IR astro shots though as the objects i wanted to try it with aren't visible at the moment.

Looking forward to seeing some images from the 10D

Ian

[Graham_of_Rainham]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

I have been playing with an IR filter on my old C8080 and on the E-PL1. The colours on the RAW files are very different, which to me indicates not just the difference in the sensor and processing of the light that gets through the IR Filter, but also in the way the Auto White Balance is trying to correct for what is nothing like what it expects.

SO: Is it best to do a Custom White Balance shot from some grass at high noon (as is suggested by some) or to set a CWB by knowing what the filter transmits (whatever that is)

OR: Do we shoot in RAW and Manipulate the files to get the end result to look the way we want.

Is Real any more real if it's colour channels are swapped and the WB is altered, than a good high contrast image that is then Simulated.

I can see a lot of experimentation is needed to home in on the best technique for producing IR pictures. Hopefully the simulated ones will not become so good that we can't tell the difference.

[Patrick]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

I have been playing with an IR filter on my old C8080 and on the E-PL1. The colours on the RAW files are very different, which to me indicates not just the difference in the sensor and processing of the light that gets through the IR Filter, but also in the way the Auto White Balance is trying to correct for what is nothing like what it expects.

SO: Is it best to do a Custom White Balance shot from some grass at high noon (as is suggested by some) or to set a CWB by knowing what the filter transmits (whatever that is)

OR: Do we shoot in RAW and Manipulate the files to get the end result to look the way we want.

Is Real any more real if it's colour channels are swapped and the WB is altered, than a good high contrast image that is then Simulated.

I can see a lot of experimentation is needed to home in on the best technique for producing IR pictures. Hopefully the simulated ones will not become so good that we can't tell the difference.

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

All I did for the second colour one (the third version of the tree) is swap the red and blue channels in Photoshop and mess around with levels, colour balance and white balance until looked attractive to me

Still experimenting!

One obvious advantage of a converted camera, especially when photographing trees, is that the exposure will be enough to freeze most action, while the long exposures required by using a filter on a non-converted camera will mean movement of the subject swaying in the wind ending up sapping some of the crispness from the result.

Ian

[Ian]

Re: IR Real or Simulated

Not had much time to play today, but here are a couple taken with the converted Olympus Pen E-PL1 this morning:


False colour version


Mono version

I still have a lot to learn!

Ian