What would you like to see in Lightroom 4

[Stephen]

I ask this somewhat with tongue in cheek, as LR3 has only been available for a short time. However I've just read Scott Kelby's Blog and he has made a list of what he would like to see. Now this guy is the President of the National Association of Photoshop Professionals, and as such he must have the ear of Adobe and in particular Tom Hogarty who is in charge of Lightroom development at Adobe.

Scotts article makes interesting reading and its not until you read what he says that you think, Oh yes, that would be great, and if only we could have this or that. If only half of what Scott suggests were implemented, it really would be even more of a killer application

[Patrick]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

I ask this somewhat with tongue in cheek, as LR3 has only been available for a short time. However I've just read Scott Kelby's Blog and he has made a list of what he would like to see. Now this guy is the President of the National Association of Photoshop Professionals, and as such he must have the ear of Adobe and in particular Tom Hogarty who is in charge of Lightroom development at Adobe.

Scotts article makes interesting reading and its not until you read what he says that you think, Oh yes, that would be great, and if only we could have this or that. If only half of what Scott suggests were implemented, it really would be even more of a killer application

Hi Stephen

I very much have an on off relationship with Lightroom, basically I like it but still hate the fact I am compelled to import my images. I have tried and tried hard to use it, but find myself reverting to Bridge and using Photoshop's RAW converter. My wish list is allow Lightroom to be used without the Library.
I will not in the foreseeable future buy the LR3 upgrade, but save my pennies and upgrade PS4 to PS5.

Patrick

[Josh Bear]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

Hi Stephen,

I've been a LR user since the start of the program and have found it excellent. I have LR3 and have been ploughing through Scott Kelbys latest book to help me with my Tuscany photos. The one thing I would like to see next is a much better cloning tool as I find the current one a bit cumbersome.

best regards

Josh

[Autumn]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

Hi Stephen,

I've been a LR user since the start of the program and have found it excellent. I have LR3 and have been ploughing through Scott Kelbys latest book to help me with my Tuscany photos. The one thing I would like to see next is a much better cloning tool as I find the current one a bit cumbersome.

Josh

I find the current one unuseable except for dust spots.

I would also like a "Back" button. If I delete a folder from a section, it immediately pops back to the top of the page and I have to scroll to where I was. Most annoying.

I did suggest this during the Beta period, to no avail.

[Stephen]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

Hi Stephen

I very much have an on off relationship with Lightroom, basically I like it but still hate the fact I am compelled to import my images. I have tried and tried hard to use it, but find myself reverting to Bridge and using Photoshop's RAW converter. My wish list is allow Lightroom to be used without the Library.
I will not in the foreseeable future buy the LR3 upgrade, but save my pennies and upgrade PS4 to PS5.

Patrick

Hi Patrick, IMO Lightroom is a program you have to 'GET' or you simply are not able to make full use of it, and certainly not take full advantage of what it offers. So to some extent I can understand your point of view and you are therefore probably as well sticking with Bridge and ACR in CS4. For me though I changed my workflow to fit in with the way LR worked and I've never looked back. The Library then is an integral part of the program, and to loose it would mean a lot of its functionality would go.

[Patrick]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

Hi Patrick, IMO Lightroom is a program you have to 'GET' or you simply are not able to make full use of it, and certainly not take full advantage of what it offers. So to some extent I can understand your point of view and you are therefore probably as well sticking with Bridge and ACR in CS4. For me though I changed my workflow to fit in with the way LR worked and I've never looked back. The Library then is an integral part of the program, and to loose it would mean a lot of its functionality would go.

I like the print module very much, and have used the slide module quite often. The processing is very like ACR, just one or two variants. I particularly like the crop tool, the way the image is moved rather that the crop rectangle its self. There are other things in themselves unimportant but mount up into feeling comfortable and liking they way it all works.
Just I can't get used to that bloody library, it just doesn't lend itself to my mindset.

Patrick

[Shenstone]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

What I would like to see is it fully merged with PS in such a way that the best of all comes together in a single application

The frustrating thing with LR and PS in CS5 is that both have things that the other should have and there isn't a clear differention between the products for most basic develop/tweak/metadata purposes, but when you get a bit more advanced you have to choose one or th eother

I think that many people using LR for cataloguing would be as well served by Bridge, but then at the other many who want more should probably look at more capable DRM solutions such as Imatch which has a much better database type structure.

Like Patrick I can't get into my mind how the LR catalogue is helping much with my workflow and as I've said I have better and faster programmes for that. I do use Bridge as it is typically a lot faster to browse folders with as it doesn't build a (IMO) sluggish catalogue, but then you are limited to one folder at a time.

I do like and always have liked the RAW development UI in LR it's better than the Camera Raw interface in subtle ways but it helps a lot even though you can do all the same things. You can't call LR develop module direct from other programmes (well I haven't work out how if you can [ v 2.5 ]). Copying develop settings between images isn't easier in LR than Bridge and IMO a little slow so once again not a differentiation point, but somethign to improve in CS6/LR4

Neither offer a structured undo in a simple manner in Raw development such as you get in PS this would be a real boon to me as I like to try things out and undo and that sometimes means moving between panes and that gets less easy to undo in LR or Camera Raw

I see people like Josh asking for "better cloning tool" but that's already there in PS so why would they add it to LR when they can get you to spend more?

In summary I've decided to upgrade to PS CS5 (I've not actually done it yet) rather than LR which i will probably drop and enhance my workflows in Imatch and ACR. I'm definitely not upgrading both when there is so much overlap between the programmes hence I would like to see them merge in CS6

Regards
Andy

[Patrick]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

What I would like to see is it fully merged with PS in such a way that the best of all comes together in a single application

The frustrating thing with LR and PS in CS5 is that both have things that the other should have and there isn't a clear differention between the products for most basic develop/tweak/metadata purposes, but when you get a bit more advanced you have to choose one or th eother

I think that many people using LR for cataloguing would be as well served by Bridge, but then at the other many who want more should probably look at more capable DRM solutions such as Imatch which has a much better database type structure.

Like Patrick I can't get into my mind how the LR catalogue is helping much with my workflow and as I've said I have better and faster programmes for that. I do use Bridge as it is typically a lot faster to browse folders with as it doesn't build a (IMO) sluggish catalogue, but then you are limited to one folder at a time.

I do like and always have liked the RAW development UI in LR it's better than the Camera Raw interface in subtle ways but it helps a lot even though you can do all the same things. You can't call LR develop module direct from other programmes (well I haven't work out how if you can [ v 2.5 ]). Copying develop settings between images isn't easier in LR than Bridge and IMO a little slow so once again not a differentiation point, but somethign to improve in CS6/LR4

Neither offer a structured undo in a simple manner in Raw development such as you get in PS this would be a real boon to me as I like to try things out and undo and that sometimes means moving between panes and that gets less easy to undo in LR or Camera Raw

I see people like Josh asking for "better cloning tool" but that's already there in PS so why would they add it to LR when they can get you to spend more?

In summary I've decided to upgrade to PS CS5 (I've not actually done it yet) rather than LR which i will probably drop and enhance my workflows in Imatch and ACR. I'm definitely not upgrading both when there is so much overlap between the programmes hence I would like to see them merge in CS6

Regards
Andy

Nice to know I'm not the only one to be uncomfortable with Library, I was beginning to feel lonely I don't use a catalog program of any kind I have a system of my own devising and can find anything I want as it is. I try and use it within Lightroom but it doesn't sit well with the program.
I agree with you with regard the clone tool, its not designed or intended to replace the one in Photoshop, its a spot remover more than anything and as such works well. I must admit I'm re-thinking whether to invest in the upgrade from LR2 to LR3 for the improved RAW processing,the better noise control, and the more advanced lens correction facility. These may very well feature in CS5 but at the higher cost and CS4 really does everything else I require.

Patrick

[Stephen]

Re: What would you would like to see in Lightroom 4

What I would like to see is it fully merged with PS in such a way that the best of all comes together in a single application

The frustrating thing with LR and PS in CS5 is that both have things that the other should have and there isn't a clear differention between the products for most basic develop/tweak/metadata purposes, but when you get a bit more advanced you have to choose one or th eother

I think that many people using LR for cataloguing would be as well served by Bridge, but then at the other many who want more should probably look at more capable DRM solutions such as Imatch which has a much better database type structure.

Like Patrick I can't get into my mind how the LR catalogue is helping much with my workflow and as I've said I have better and faster programmes for that. I do use Bridge as it is typically a lot faster to browse folders with as it doesn't build a (IMO) sluggish catalogue, but then you are limited to one folder at a time.

I do like and always have liked the RAW development UI in LR it's better than the Camera Raw interface in subtle ways but it helps a lot even though you can do all the same things. You can't call LR develop module direct from other programmes (well I haven't work out how if you can [ v 2.5 ]). Copying develop settings between images isn't easier in LR than Bridge and IMO a little slow so once again not a differentiation point, but somethign to improve in CS6/LR4

Neither offer a structured undo in a simple manner in Raw development such as you get in PS this would be a real boon to me as I like to try things out and undo and that sometimes means moving between panes and that gets less easy to undo in LR or Camera Raw

I see people like Josh asking for "better cloning tool" but that's already there in PS so why would they add it to LR when they can get you to spend more?

In summary I've decided to upgrade to PS CS5 (I've not actually done it yet) rather than LR which i will probably drop and enhance my workflows in Imatch and ACR. I'm definitely not upgrading both when there is so much overlap between the programmes hence I would like to see them merge in CS6

Regards
Andy

Hi Andy and thanks for making a considered response to this thread. You make some fair points, but I can't help feeling that you haven't totally got to grips with some of the functions available in LR.

The program IMO is a completely different beast to Photoshop & Bridge, apart from the fact it uses the same ACR, albeit in a more user friendly way. It is aimed at a different part of the market and IMO one that doesn't want to have to move from one program to another to do certain tasks. Hence the different modules which to a greater or lesser degree efficiently do tasks often not available in PS.

The Library module performs many functions and is not only a DAM element of the program. I do use keywords which are added on import. However the nature of my work means that I don't need to keyword individual files in a folder and usually the keywords are not a lot different to what is used in the folder name. Apart from keywords though its easy to find photos taken at particular times, lenses, focal lengths, indeed pretty much any metadata, or label the photos have. Its all available in the library filter. I haven't used iMatch, but I can't imagine why I would want to use a separate program to do any sort of search when I feel I have one in LR that does all I want. Whilst in the Library module I can organise my photos, much the same as Bridge with colour labels, stars or flags. I can also though add anyone to a quick collection, which can then be saved later with an appropriate name to be recovered instantly at a later time, all without moving or altering the original. Have you used collection? They were a revelation to me when I discovered them. I find them particularly useful when I want to create a slideshow or web gallery. With some jobs, once I have selected using the various tools available I can delete the rest of a folder that do not go to a client, I can also delete the resulting jpegs the client receives and they just take up space and I know I can reproduce them extremely quickly if I want to. The library module also has a quick develop panel which allows me to make quick and easy tweaks to all selected shots with just a few clicks. I don't use if often but it can be useful.

You say "Copying develop settings between images isn't easier in LR than Bridge and IMO a little slow so once again not a differentiation point, but somethign to improve in CS6/LR4 " and yet I find this extremely easy and quick, infact one of the biggest time savers for me. The Sync tool is one of the most used tools in LR for me. Not only this but the spraycan/painter tool can be very useful to apply a preset or a whole host of other things to individual images.

LR 3 by the way also has a Publish Services function for uploading to the likes of Flickr or Facebook. I don't use this, however I have discovered that I can program it so that I can put selected photos into a particular folder and this is then sent automatically to my Dropbox where it is transferred to my other machine or is simply held in "The Cloud" for use anywhere.

I don't see the cloning tool thing as an issue. I generally will use the Heal tool for spotting and in many respects its better than the regular one in PS. But I just accept that anything more detailed must be done in PS after the file has been exported.

You also mention "Neither offer a structured undo in a simple manner in Raw development such as you get in PS this would be a real boon to me as I like to try things out and undo and that sometimes means moving between panes and that gets less easy to undo in LR or Camera Raw" and yet there is a comprehensive history panel in the Develop module and you can return to any point where you have made an adjustment. You can also create a snapshot or virtual copy at any time to work on if that's helpful. I don't see any issues then with going back to a particular point.

There are so many tools available in LR and the Slideshow, Print and Web modules, while not perfect are the icing on the cake for me as a working photographer. I would hope that in V4 Adobe would add more functionality to these. For me, and make no mistake, I have limited funds too, if I was to choose between upgrading LR2 or CS4 I would without hesitation go for LR. I've already got LR3 so that's academic now and is probably an indication of the type post processing I need or like to do.

[OlyPaul]

Re: What would you like to see in Lightroom 4

I'd like a better search function with the ability to search for subjects but exclude a particular subject from the search.

I know you can do it by doing your search for the subjects you want and then putting them into a collection and then doing another search on that collection to exclude the subjects you do not want in the image.

But this is a rather convoluted approach to something that should be simple and quick to do in a Dam program. Apart from that I'm quite happy with LR3.