mono distant lands

[chryslerchick]

took this pic whilst on hols in wales uk in october i tried to keep the pic in layers to ease the eye into it. i did realy like it but after further inspection i think maybe it looks to flat...any tips on what i should have done?




p.s black & whites are done via my camera settings not via the comp

[Steve40]

Naw, I didn't like it.

[chryslerchick]

Re: mono distant lands

thanks steve your comments are appreciated, but can you help me by letting me know what's actualy wrong ,as im new to photography & need all the advice i can get how else will i learn

[Tom]

Re: mono distant lands

took this pic whilst on hols in wales uk in october i tried to keep the pic in layers to ease the eye into it. i did realy like it but after further inspection i think maybe it looks to flat...any tips on what i should have done?

p.s black & whites are done via my camera settings not via the comp

Happy New Year Chryslerchick.
Very well seen. I think you have a great composition here with very good depth but it just needs a lift here and there. Its pretty flat all over and this may be due to the cameras recording of B/W.
I usually take them in colour and then convert using the Channel Mixer in Photoshop.(then you have both versions) There are lots of other and pbobably better methods available.
There some detail in the sky that needs to be brought out and overall contrast can be improved. I d/loaded your image and had a quick fiddle and I'm happy to post the result if you would like that.

[Bearface]

Re: mono distant lands

I don't think it's a bad shot at all, although personally I tend to avoid letting the camera convert to mono because all control over the tones and contrast is lost completely. In this case, the sky - which you could've adjusted in a post-processing suite to boost the contrast and depth - looks too flat and uninspiring.

The foreground is interesting enough, although there isn't a natural path through the scene which makes viewing much easier at a subconscious level. Again, I'd suggest that more contrast and indeed some extra detail could be pulled from this area, but it's definitely better than the sky

To be honest, when you have a bright sky and a shadowy foreground like this, it's generally better to use a tripod and bracket (eg. three shots taken in succession - one underexposed, one overexposed and one which the camera deems to be just about right ) your exposures so that you have a correctly exposed foreground and a correctly exposed sky. You can then (afterwards, in post-processing) blend the best exposures together - using layers - to get the optimum image.

Alternatively, you could simply meter for the sky (thus underexposiing the shot overall) to save the cloud detail and then bring up the shadow detail (foreground rocks etc) in post-processing. Thanks to the relatively poor (compared to film) dynamic range of digital cameras, it's very tricky to get such a contrasty exposure right in a single shot. You can of course compromise, but this is a new year and compromises can wait until at least June or July....

[Steve40]

Re: mono distant lands

cryslerchick.

My comment wasn't referring to your photo, it was about my attempt to correct it that I posted. Like bearface said, you cannot get a good range of tones from in camera B&W conversions.

A black & white photo should have a broad range of gray tones, ranging from black, to white. Something, I have never seen a digital camera do well. I usually do b&w as post image processing, the color when converted gives you a much broader range of contrasting tones to work with.

I have several programs to do this with, but I could not get your shot to look any better than a badly under exposed one, with any of them. The contrast range is just not there, and I could not get it to look the way I wanted.

Black & white photography depends on a play of light and shadows, to keep it from looking flat. I find not all color photos make good b&w ones, only a few can make the grade. Because folks are shooting from a prospective of colors, not from a prospective of light.

A good b&w shot does not depend on the camera or the photographer, It only depends on the photographer to recognize it. When you want to take a b&w shot, its best to take a color shot first. But your eyes must learn to see the gray tones, not the colors. You have to learn what scenes make a good play of light, and shadows. B&W is more about the dramatic than the subject matter, color is about the color, the two do not interchange always.

[Patrick]

Re: mono distant lands

took this pic whilst on hols in wales uk in october i tried to keep the pic in layers to ease the eye into it. i did realy like it but after further inspection i think maybe it looks to flat...any tips on what i should have done?




p.s black & whites are done via my camera settings not via the comp

[Steve40]

Re: mono distant lands

Well, I really thought I did make a plain comment. It just AINT got it. Any attempt to do anything with it results in artifacts, and really makes it look worse. The scene is ok, but would have been better taken in color, then converted. And possibly bracketed, I tried this after the fact but it did not work any better than other attempts I made.

[Patrick]

Re: mono distant lands

Well, I really thought I did make a plain comment. It just AINT got it. Any attempt to do anything with it results in artifacts, and really makes it look worse. The scene is ok, but would have been better taken in color, then converted. And possibly bracketed, I tried this after the fact but it did not work any better than other attempts I made.

Then why not say so? it would have been positive comment and possibly of some help to Chryslerchick. instead of just There is no rule to say we have to like something, but when saying it reasons can be helpful to any author.
Incidentally the artefacts could be more to do with the fact the picture has been reduced to a small JPG for posting, work done on the original full size file would probably yield much better quality.

Patrick

[Steve40]

Re: mono distant lands

Oh! I see you did not read the post after bearface's post, explaining the "Naw I didn't like it" part.

[Tinka]

Re: mono distant lands

took this pic whilst on hols in wales uk in october i tried to keep the pic in layers to ease the eye into it. i did realy like it but after further inspection i think maybe it looks to flat...any tips on what i should have done?




p.s black & whites are done via my camera settings not via the comp

Hi Chryslerchick,
This image proves that you can visualise/see a potential photograph in a scene, yes the image is a little flat, but can be inproved with post processing, and the image is worth it in my humble opinion, I always take in color and convert, useing adjustment layers of various types, but the old and reliable favorit is channel mixer. but try useing levels and curves on this image, to see what results you get, and work from there.
A very promising image. (and photographer)

[chryslerchick]

Re: mono distant lands

thanks everyone for your help.thanks patrick i can see what you mean now, i will take all your advice & take in colour then convert then this must be why my grave yard shots in my gallery also look very drab & flat then as im always using the mono on the camera,its just that by using the mono on camera i seem to see more of what im looking for than when im using colour.the colour seems to distract my eye, if that makes sense.will have a fiddle about with some of my colour pics & see how i go.thanks again for all the advice,this sort of help doesnt come in the instruction manual & its very much appreciated brenda

[Patrick]

Re: mono distant lands

thanks everyone for your help.thanks patrick i can see what you mean now, i will take all your advice & take in colour then convert then this must be why my grave yard shots in my gallery also look very drab & flat then as im always using the mono on the camera,its just that by using the mono on camera i seem to see more of what im looking for than when im using colour.the colour seems to distract my eye, if that makes sense.will have a fiddle about with some of my colour pics & see how i go.thanks again for all the advice,this sort of help doesnt come in the instruction manual & its very much appreciated brenda

You have just said something quite telling, that you find colour gets in the way. Many very experienced and in some cases famous photographers have been known to say the same thing about their images.
I shoot everything in RAW and currently use Adobe Lightroom Beta 4 to process the image; it has a wonderful B/W converter. It worth noting JPG,s can be adjusted in lightroom, its not just a RAW converter.
It can be downloaded free as a Beta and used until the retail version is launched.

Patrick

[chryslerchick]

Re: mono distant lands

You have just said something quite telling, that you find colour gets in the way. Many very experienced and in some cases famous photographers have been known to say the same thing about their images. I shoot everything in RAW and currently use Adobe Lightroom Beta 4 to process the image; it has a wonderful B/W converter. It worth noting JPG,s can be adjusted in lightroom, its not just a RAW converter.
It can be downloaded free as a Beta and used until the retail version is launched.

Patrick

oooohh maybe my brain is telling me something right 4 a change i dont know what it is i like about B&W it seems to show me the natural image even though the world is in colour ? sorry patrick the rest ie raw is totaly wasted on me im still in those early stages of figuring out how to actualy get the camera on the correct settings for the pic i want let alone converting to raw etc,maybe in a few years when i can get some sort of hang of the camera

[Patrick]

Re: mono distant lands

oooohh maybe my brain is telling me something right 4 a change i dont know what it is i like about B&W it seems to show me the natural image even though the world is in colour ? sorry patrick the rest ie raw is totaly wasted on me im still in those early stages of figuring out how to actualy get the camera on the correct settings for the pic i want let alone converting to raw etc,maybe in a few years when i can get some sort of hang of the camera

With the enthusiasm you are displaying I'm sure you will get to grips with the camera and be exploring the possibility's of Raw files in no time. Remember Lightroom can be used for your JPG's, and using it would help you lean your way round the program before attacking RAW, and you would also find out that RAW is no great mystery.

Patrick