Night Photography problems

[Gina]

Hi all,

I'm having problems with night photography with my canon 400d. This shot is probably the better one of the shoot but still has problems. I would guess that it is camera shake as I didn't use a tripod. I leaned on the wall to try and stabalise the camera. If it's just camera shake for the reasons mentioned then it's fixable. I understand that night shots need longer exposure and the lens aperture would be as wide as possible to capture the light - am I right?



Any help and advice would help my understanding of night photography very much.

p.s. The gallery linking thumnail / copy and paste is frustrating as hell. Please admin - when you do get a chance, please look at this.


Gina

[Ian]

Re: Night Photography problems

Hi Gina,

If you use My Pics, it's just two clicks or so from the forum Advanced message editor.

Just ensure Original Image and 'inline' are set.

Let me know if you need any help to get going with this - there is an explanation here:

http://dpnow.com/forum2/showthread.php?t=1337

Ian

[Gina]

Re: Night Photography problems

Thank you Ian

xx

[Patrick]

Re: Night Photography problems

Hi all,

I'm having problems with night photography with my canon 400d. This shot is probably the better one of the shoot but still has problems. I would guess that it is camera shake as I didn't use a tripod. I leaned on the wall to try and stabalise the camera. If it's just camera shake for the reasons mentioned then it's fixable. I understand that night shots need longer exposure and the lens aperture would be as wide as possible to capture the light - am I right?



Any help and advice would help my understanding of night photography very much.

p.s. The gallery linking thumnail / copy and paste is frustrating as hell. Please admin - when you do get a chance, please look at this.


Gina

The camera has to be stable which means a tripod for this type of shot, it is helpful to use wide apertures but not essential if the camera is not going to move. Long exposures can bring problems with reciprocity which is in simple terms is a loss of sensitivity as exposures become long, in some cases doubling and more the exposure read by the meter.
Not sure if its a bigger problem with digital than film.
Whatever use a tripod.

Incidentally it would have been a really good shot had it been sharp.

Patrick

[coupekid]

Re: Night Photography problems

The camera has to be stable which means a tripod for this type of shot, it is helpful to use wide apertures but not essential if the camera is not going to move. Long exposures can bring problems with reciprocity which is in simple terms is a loss of sensitivity as exposures become long, in some cases doubling and more the exposure read by the meter.
Not sure if its a bigger problem with digital than film.
Whatever use a tripod.

Incidentally it would have been a really good shot had it been sharp.

Patrick

Just to add to what Patrick has said there, if you have image stabalisation when using a tripod, turn it off. Also a remote release is desirable, if you dont have one, stick your camera on timed mode. Touching the camera, even slightly to push the button can cause camera shake.

[Patrick]

Re: Night Photography problems

Just to add to what Patrick has said there, if you have image stabalisation when using a tripod, turn it off. Also a remote release is desirable, if you dont have one, stick your camera on timed mode. Touching the camera, even slightly to push the button can cause camera shake.

Yep, perfect advice.

Patrick

[Tinka]

Re: Night Photography problems

Incidentally it would have been a really good shot had it been sharp.

Hi Gina,
A super image as has already been said, spoiled by the sharpness problem,
Go back and try again if the oprtunity arises.
I had a play with your image hope you don't mind, I enlarged it to 800 wide and used unsharp mask, I feel that it helped a little but that is all I could do as I am away from my main computer and had to use a portable version of P-Shop. Perhaps a little tweeking on the original could eliminate most of the unsharpness?

[Patrick]

Re: Night Photography problems

Incidentally it would have been a really good shot had it been sharp.

Hi Gina,
A super image as has already been said, spoiled by the sharpness problem,
Go back and try again if the oprtunity arises.
I had a play with your image hope you don't mind, I enlarged it to 800 wide and used unsharp mask, I feel that it helped a little but that is all I could do as I am away from my main computer and had to use a portable version of P-Shop. Perhaps a little tweeking on the original could eliminate most of the unsharpness?

Using more and more USM I doubt will help, it will simply highlight artifact and create a halo effect.
Much is misunderstood about USM it will only sharpen sharp images, images that suffer camera shake or are out of focus it can do little to help, it may cheat the eye to a degee by increasing edge contrast but little more.

Patrick

[Tinka]

Re: Night Photography problems

Using more and more USM I doubt will help, it will simply highlight artifact and create a halo effect.
Much is misunderstood about USM it will only sharpen sharp images, images that suffer camera shake or are out of focus it can do little to help, it may cheat the eye to a degee by increasing edge contrast but little more.

Patrick

Hi Patrick,
I agree, (I will always have a go at saving an image if I can, with very limited success I might add ) With a full version of PS other methods of sharpening are possible and may reduce the side effects, this "MAY" allow an acceptable small print to be made (perhaps 6x4). The real answer is to return to take another image, but will the conditions arise to allow this same or very nearly the same image to be taken again soon?

[coupekid]

Re: Night Photography problems

Using more and more USM I doubt will help, it will simply highlight artifact and create a halo effect.
Much is misunderstood about USM it will only sharpen sharp images, images that suffer camera shake or are out of focus it can do little to help, it may cheat the eye to a degee by increasing edge contrast but little more.

Patrick

USM may not help, but dont forget that PS CS2 (and doubtless 3) has some extra sharpening features that are able to combat motion blur, so using these may help a little more than just adding a dose of unsharp mask.

Bottom line is always going to be re-take with a tripod though.

If anyone has any recomendations for a nice reasonably priced tripod for Gina, I would like to hear by the way, I am getting one for Christmas! My two tripods have now become bipods!

Budget is pretty broad for me as I can always bung a little extra in, but around 50quid would be nice.

[Ian]

Re: Night Photography problems

USM may not help, but dont forget that PS CS2 (and doubtless 3) has some extra sharpening features that are able to combat motion blur, so using these may help a little more than just adding a dose of unsharp mask.

Bottom line is always going to be re-take with a tripod though.

If anyone has any recomendations for a nice reasonably priced tripod for Gina, I would like to hear by the way, I am getting one for Christmas! My two tripods have now become bipods!

Budget is pretty broad for me as I can always bung a little extra in, but around 50quid would be nice.

What have you been doing to your tripods, Ben?

Ian

[Patrick]

Re: Night Photography problems

Hi Patrick,
I agree, (I will always have a go at saving an image if I can, with very limited success I might add: ) With a full version of PS other methods of sharpening are possible and may reduce the side effects, this "MAY" allow an acceptable small print to be made (perhaps 6x4). The real answer is to return to take another image, but will the conditions arise to allow this same or very nearly the same image to be taken again soon?

Well yes, a rescued image will remain just that a rescued image, however much will depend on what is wanted, if it were me a 6x4 just wouldn't be of any interest.
These night shots don't go away and remain constant as the artificial light is what they are about, it doesn't really matter if its wet or dry although wet could be more interesting.
The answer is for Gina go back and take more pictures but with a tripod and learn by the experience.

What it could be used for would be a very good backdrop for a composite picture, now there is a thought.

Patrick

[Ian]

Re: Night Photography problems

Well yes, a rescued image will remain just that a rescued image, however much will depend on what is wanted, if it were me a 6x4 just wouldn't be of any interest.
These night shots don't go away and remain constant as the artificial light is what they are about, it doesn't really matter if its wet or dry although wet could be more interesting.
The answer is for Gina go back and take more pictures but with a tripod and learn by the experience.

What it could be used for would be a very good backdrop for a composite picture, now there is a thought.

Patrick

General notes (not for Patrick of course!) Even without a tripod, you can get rock-steady shots by placing the camera on a wall or other steady supporting structure. Use the delayed release or self-timer to avoid having to touch the camera when the shot is taken.

Experiment with deliberately setting the camera to under-expose and use the lowest ISO setting for best noise and saturation.

Ian

[coupekid]

Re: Night Photography problems

What have you been doing to your tripods, Ben?

Ian

Well, to be fair, one of my tripods is about 20years old, its one my father had.

The other, was a another second hand one, that my mate gave me, it already had a busted leg, both tripods work ok, but you just cant extend all the legs out, so I hve to use them quite low down..... not ideal!

Good old wifey has offered to get me one for Chrimbo though! I guess you cant go wrong with a manfrotto? any other thoughts on what to go for?

[Patrick]

Re: Night Photography problems

General notes (not for Patrick of course!) Even without a tripod, you can get rock-steady shots by placing the camera on a wall or other steady supporting structure. Use the delayed release or self-timer to avoid having to touch the camera when the shot is taken.

Experiment with deliberately setting the camera to under-expose and use the lowest ISO setting for best noise and saturation.

Ian

Now Ian watch it

Here's one I took in York about two years ago, I may have posted it before I can't remember.

800ISO, f4.5, 1/8sec

No tripod stood the camera on a bridge wall and very carefully made the exposure.

Patrick