Red Button Day?

[JSR]

Is Wednesday 15th going to be a Red Day for Button and the others in this diffuser row?

I've just been watching this clip: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/moto...ne/7999068.stm

It shows Ross Brawn leaving the hearing for the day. That does not look like a confident man to me. The Ferrari guy, while being just as cagey, doesn't seem anywhere near as concerned as Brawn does.

Before the hearing, I would have said that there's no chance of the diffuser being declared illegal but, having watched Ross Brawn here, I think this is going to be a Red Day for Button & co. I think the appeal is going to be upheld.

If this is true, I think it'll prove to be yet another bad day for F1. The FIA overruling two different stewards at two different races will be the start of yet another debacle into the comedy of errors known as F1.

Not only that, but I wonder how many people will be put off watching F1? I understand the regulations are there to slow the cars down but if there are ways of speeding the cars up while maintaining safety, then surely F1 should be supporting such ingenuity? It is F1, after all - not fairground Dodg'ems.

I hope that Brawn is just playing a blind and that he secretly thinks it will go his way, but his demeanour in that video suggests otherwise. I sense clouds approaching, and no silver lines.

[devilgas]

Re: Red Button Day?

in the interests of F1, my opinion is that the FIA will grudgingly declare them legal for this year, but close the loophole for next season. the stewards declared them legal in the first 2 races and the FIA went along with that. to reverse that decision now will seriously (further?) blacken the image of f1.
aiui, the rules haven't been broken, however an incomplete wording of the reg governing the diffusers has been exploited by 3 teams. ok, it goes against the spirit of the regs, however it doesn't break the regs. a lot of sour grapes as the others hadn't spotted the loophole.

i'm surprised no-one has raised the issue of the wing mirrors. the FIA were keen to get rid of all the little winglets and fins and other airflow modifiers on the sides of the cars. most teams had 'regular' wing mirror mounts fixed to the side pods. a certain team have dedicated vertical wings extending from the floorpan on which the mirrors are mounted. within the spirit of the regs? within the regs at all?

[JSR]

Re: Red Button Day?

My understanding is that Ross Brawn highlighted to the other teams last year that the regulations were worded in an imprecise way but the other teams were not interested in altering the wording and restricting what could be done.

Now they're all complaining about it.

If good sense prevails, it should be declared legal - if only because it's shaken up the front of the grid and given us one heck of an interesting start to the season, instead of just another Ferrari/McLaren "trading punches" year. The year will evolve over the coming races as other teams adapt their cars at different times. This could be the most exciting year in F1 for a very long time. It certainly makes me look ahead to the rest of the season with anticipation and not resignation as is usually the case.

Personally, I don't see how the act of making an F1 car go "faster and safer" is against the spirit of anything in F1. Surely the spirit of F1 is to be the best, and be the safest while being the best?

I just read from Ross Brawn's manner that he's not as confident as he was previously sounding. My fingers are crossed, though.

[Cogito]

Re: Red Button Day?

If this is true, I think it'll prove to be yet another bad day for F1. The FIA overruling two different stewards at two different races will be the start of yet another debacle into the comedy of errors known as F1.

Not only that, but I wonder how many people will be put off watching F1? I understand the regulations are there to slow the cars down but if there are ways of speeding the cars up while maintaining safety, then surely F1 should be supporting such ingenuity? It is F1, after all - not fairground Dodg'ems.

You are absolutely right as far as I am concerned - I'm not a big F1 fan (heresy around here, I think!) but I have watched and enjoyed the first two races on BBC - not least because of the interesting shake-up at the top with a "brand new" team coming in and upsetting the old-guard.

Frankly, if the results of the first races are made null and void I will feel that's a few hours of my time which have been wasted and I'll probably not bother watching again.

Regards,

Neil

[devilgas]

Re: Red Button Day?

Personally, I don't see how the act of making an F1 car go "faster and safer" is against the spirit of anything in F1. Surely the spirit of F1 is to be the best, and be the safest while being the best?

diffusers merely shape the airflow. the regs, iirc, stated that teams could have only one downward facing diffuser at the rear. most teams read this as a single diffuser. brawn, toyota & williams read this as multiple diffusers, as long as only one of them was downward facing. the 'spirit' of the regs was for a single diffuser, the loophole said otherwise.
the diffusers in question add very little, if any performance, however they do disrupt the airflow for following cars, hence the removal of all the carcrashesque winglets that were evident last year.

guess we'll find out in a few hours if the FIA are going to make another monumental cock-up.

[Ian]

Re: Red Button Day?

Even of the appeal is upheld, I think it would be much more damaging if the results for the first two races should be changed, especially for the drivers.

Anyhow, although I'm confident that the appeal will be dismissed (how many times have appeals like this been successful?), even if it is successful, I think Brawn will continue to be quick.

Ian

[Ian]

Re: Red Button Day?

The WMSC ruling is just in and the diffusers are legal!

Ian

[JSR]

Re: Red Button Day?

The WMSC ruling is just in and the diffusers are legal!

Ian

Yeah, great news at last!

This decision should help strengthen the sport as it will prove, once and for all, that they don't always rule in Ferrari's favour. (I've never believed the conspiracy theories, but declaring the diffusers illegal would just support those theories).

More info (I think): http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre...ca_150409.aspx, re:

Press Release
International Court of Appeal - Decision
15/04/2009

The FIA International Court of Appeal has decided to deny the appeals submitted against decisions numbered 16 to 24 taken by the Panel of the Stewards on 26 March at the 2009 Grand Prix of Australia and counting towards the 2009 FIA Formula One World Championship.

Based on the arguments heard and evidence before it, the Court has concluded that the Stewards were correct to find that the cars in question comply with the applicable regulations.

Full reasons for this decision will be provided in due course.

I think they're talking about the diffusers? Right?

[JSR]

Re: Red Button Day?

Now on the BBC website: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/moto...ne/7996698.stm, re:

Motorsport's governing body has ruled the Brawn GP car, which has taken Briton Jenson Button to two wins this season, is legal.

A panel heard eight hours of strongly worded evidence on Tuesday after complaints that Brawn, Toyota and Williams, use an illegal diffuser.

And the five International Court of Appeal judges said the designs "comply with the applicable regulations".

[Ian]

Re: Red Button Day?

The Brawn car is one of the cleanest looking designs, with no extra barge boards and big aerodynamically designed vertical mirror supports around the front of the side pods. The front wing does look quite complex cmopares, say, to the McLaren or Ferrari wings, but overall the Brawn is very tidy. Brawn have to be favourites for China this weekend... maybe it will be Rubens' turn?

Ian

[devilgas]

Re: Red Button Day?

wow, the FIA getting something right!
they'll get chance to make amends in 2 weeks (?) time with the maclaren / hamilton lying stuff.....

[Ian]

Re: Red Button Day?

wow, the FIA getting something right!
they'll get chance to make amends in 2 weeks (?) time with the maclaren / hamilton lying stuff.....

I see there is some speculation that Hamilton's advisers may try to engineer a move from McLaren to Brawn, at the expense of Barrichello...

Ian

[JSR]

Re: Red Button Day?

wow, the FIA getting something right!
they'll get chance to make amends in 9 days (?) time with the maclaren / hamilton lying stuff.....

That's true.

But, to be fair, it's going to be a real tough job for McLaren's lawyers to prove that Hamilton, Ryan, and others in the team didn't either lie, conspire to lie, compound a lie after the fact, be complicit in a coverup, and/or support misleading the stewards.

Most or all of that would appear to be true, so all they can do is "damage limitation" in how much it will affect the team in general and Hamilton in particular.

[JSR]

Re: Red Button Day?

I see there is some speculation that Hamilton's advisers may try to engineer a move from McLaren to Brawn, at the expense of Barrichello...

Ian

For all that they'd like to "engineer" such a move, I hope that Brawn tells them to get on their carthorse.

Brawn have the perfect team right now. Two fantastic drivers with years of experience, a team principal who's the lead of the field, and the best car on the circuit.

Why on Earth would they want to pay a small fortune to oust Barrichello, force Button into "driver 2" position, just to bag "Mr Controversial" in their lead car?

Please, don't let it be so. Brawn GP is just fine the way it is.

[Ian]

Re: Red Button Day?

Rain forecast for Sunday

http://news.bbc.co.uk/weather/forecast/1713?&search=shanghai&pageSize=10&region=world

Ian