Is this Black and white

[Mike Parr]

I would ask for opinions on this as to wether its true B/W


regards
Mike

[Patrick]

Re: Is this Black and white

I would ask for opinions on this as to wether its true B/W


regards
Mike

Hi Mike

I am a little confused as to why you ask, there is clearly no colour in this image (its rather flat but that's not what you are asking about) The PAGB "THE PHOTOGRAPHIC ALLIANCE OF GREAT BRITAIN" state its Mono if no other colour is present , it can be a Mono print if toned another colour for example blue, green or red anything you like, as long as the whole image is based on the one colour. B/W is itself Mono.
John Blakemore my favourite photographer always answers "is it B/W" by saying no its shades of grey.

Patrick

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Thanks for the reply Patrick,
By flat do you mean no contrast or unintresting I do have specific reasons for asking.
regards

[Stephen]

Re: Is this Black and white

I wonder if Mike is asking the question because he has used some sort of false colour/IR filter when taking the shot?

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Correct Stephen but I feel it need something to give it punch

[Graham_of_Rainham]

Re: Is this Black and white

Mike,

This is a somewhat strange question Have you desaturated it? or used channels to render it to a film/paper "look".

True B&W is a bit of a minefield as some claim that only full gloss prints can exhibit the full range of tones and present the black as it should be.

For some, B&W needs to have that high contrast with a full range of tones with solid blacks and pure whites. Others readily accept low contrast as fully acceptable. Then there is the Hi/Lo key debate and of course the Chalk-n-Charcoal / Soot-n-Snow styles.

So I think I'll settle for describing it as "Monochromatic" and let you tell me that I've completely missed the point and there is another angle to your question

Please enlighten us

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Ok would this be acceptable to enter into a B/W category of a local competition or would a judge disregard it as mumbo jumbo

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Sorry forgot to say a IR filter was used in photoshop

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Graham, as with all images they are subjective to the viewer, I have recently joined a local camera club and have been asked to participate in a club comp for b/w buildings as this has always been a weak point for me i was playing in photoshop and came up with this in many versions.
My main reason was to find out if this type of image was acceptable in the terms of B/W as i quite like the effect
regards
Mike

[Graham_of_Rainham]

Re: Is this Black and white

I've heard of Judges comments described as "A load of old Mumbo Jumbo" used when they simply haven't "got" an image and go rambling off on their own accounts of how they would have approached the shot. But that's not what we are trained to do.

If I were given this image to judge in competition, the comments would be made in context to the competition level, and with regard to other entries. However when presented with an image in isolation, we go through the process of analysis of the image wrt composition, technical production, etc., with the subject being commented on almost as an element in it's own right.

When presented with an image of a red squirrel holding a nut it has that Arghhh.. factor that the Rat gnawing on a dead pigeon simply hasn't got, which is why the subject tends to be considered independently to the picture.

With this image I think that the subject will be given more prominence by cropping the bottom and the LH Side such that the leading diagonal passes through the key features of the subject. Such a crop also makes the aspect ratio closer to the "golden rectangle" which can often mysteriously add appeal to an image.

I personally don't like subtle IR effects. Full blown IR can be very effective but PhotoShoped IR effects need to really enhance the image and I don't see it working here.



Do let us know how you get on with the competition

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Thank you Graham, that ticks all the boxes of feedback that one needs to revisit ones work.
As I have never entered into a local comp where i would be present i have found it quite daunting. I am not worried about winning but would rather not miss the plot
I have various versions to toy with and then ive got to print something else to get right
Many thanks to those who helped me look at all angles

[Mike Parr]

Re: Is this Black and white

Here's option 2

[Stephen]

Re: Is this Black and white

Mike, I'm afraid the treatment you have given it does little for me. There is poor contrast and the tones are are quite murky looking to me. Its still in RGB format, and when I played with it a little I could see some blotchy red areas. When I made it true B/W using the Gradient map tool, I felt it had more potential. With some selective use of the Curves tool in the shadow areas and even the grassy foreground, applying a subtle vignetting and it becomes a more interesting image

[Patrick]

Re: Is this Black and white

Mike, I'm afraid the treatment you have given it does little for me. There is poor contrast and the tones are are quite murky looking to me. Its still in RGB format, and when I played with it a little I could see some blotchy red areas. When I made it true B/W using the Gradient map tool, I felt it had more potential. With some selective use of the Curves tool in the shadow areas and even the grassy foreground, applying a subtle vignetting and it becomes a more interesting image

I agree with Stephen almost entirely, Stephen has not posted the resulting image from his experiments however I hope you don't mind but I have, I however did not get any red blobs. I have gone a step further and toned the image.
Under the rules laid down by the PAGB this would still qualify for the Mono section, and so is still considered B/W although the term B/W is not used in their terms of reference, Mono is. Your club however may have its own interpretation for its own competitions, many clubs do, I don't know why it only creates confusion.

You may not like my interpretation of the image, it does rather reflect my own style, but I hope it has given you ideas of your own. If you want more exact detail of what was done I will post for you.

Patrick

[Graham_of_Rainham]

Re: Is this Black and white

Mike,
Please excuse me if I go off topic !

<snip> Its still in RGB format <snip>

Stephen,

How did you determine this


Mike,

Back to your picture. What we now have in this thread is a good example of the way different people like to see an image presented. It is this vast range of opinion that makes photography such a great activity, and comments and discussions such as this add to the fun...

I always put my pictures into competitions, in the way I like them. If others and occasionally a judge like them then that's a bonus.

after all:

1 out of focus image is a mistake ,
1000 out of focus images is a style
and it only takes a panel of them to get elected to the RPS